Performance Power

[WagN2NR]

Where do you keep the goods and why?

[GimPin]

my exhaust houseing is too small restricts the top end really bad
hopefully will be fixing that in a couple months with a 20g

[Genesis]

what do you consider power? what sells the car or moves it?
I'll take what moves it - so lower RPM

[b18cya-T]

i have a honda...so duh...im a high end motherfucker!

[WagN2NR]

Originally posted by Genesis
what do you consider power? what sells the car or moves it?
I'll take what moves it - so lower RPM

P=w/t (Moves it)

[1998cc]

Low-end 2.4 Liter. It always has torque on tap. This car really sags on the high end.

[Violator]

1.6 liter...it screams past 6000 rpm.

[SleeperZ]

My ride makes power across the whole RPM band, yo!

[JDX]

I usually get tired after I run for a while, so probably low end :D

Oh oh my car... Well it trys to die if you pop the clutch, even at 6K RPMs, and it has a hard time gettin' over 100 MPH even after flooring it from 120th to 58th on I-25... So I'll just stick to my Shoes :D (Ecko)

So, Eric, how about sellin' me that B16 before it does POP :D

[Brian]

My power comes from turbo boost :D

[stu]

When my car runs, it runs out of steam at about 4,000 rpms.

[jojo]

Turbo + V8 = Both.

[WagN2NR]

If your car puts most of its power out in the High range and you go and put a turbo on it, it will have power in the low and high areas? Turbos add low end power? I thought it was all dependent on your cam shaft. Can aftermarket valve springs change where your power somes from (From High or Low)?

[allmotor_civic]

Dyno (at my disposal) + DOHC VTEC + Longer Stroke + Long Duration Cams + High Compression + Proper Fuel, Spark, and Cam timing = Flat torque curve (flat from 2900-5400, jumps at VTEC, relitively flat from 5600-8500). So fuc* all that deciding crap. I'll take both for 200 Alec.
Dan
P.S. "Torque is for burnouts, horsepower is for racing. Dave Coleman in SCC editorial"

[WagN2NR]

VTEC changes the cam's to top end performance? The other day, Bedlam was explaneing Vtec to me. Tell me If my statement is correct.

[V8SpankR]

With my current turbo I can finally pull all the way to redline pretty hard,with my small 16g it seemed to run out of steam around 6000rpm.

[allmotor_civic]

Originally posted by WagN2NR
VTEC changes the cam's to top end performance? The other day, Bedlam was explaneing Vtec to me. Tell me If my statement is correct.
Um, well if he was trying to tell you that when VTEC is engaged that the performance is shifted higher in the RPM. Then he was correct, sort of. His statement is only applicable when VTEC is engaged and with stock cams. In my case, I have a rather large 262 degree .354" lift secondary and 245 degree .315" lift primary which is great for mid range torque on a 1.8 liter. Well in my 2.0 liter setup this makes better low-mid range torque. Then, once the VTEC crossover is eclipsed and VTEC is engaged my primary and secondary are overriden by the VTEC lobe on the camshaft. Making both lifters open the valves 302 degrees and have ~.488" of lift, great for very high rpm usage in 1.8's so in my 2.0 it is amazing for high rpm. This basically means that I have two different cams in the same engine for two different RPM ranges. Allowing the engine to have two completely different cam profiles means that power delivery is dependant on the profile currently being used by the engine to control valve opening and closing.
Dan

[WagN2NR]

I didnt quote bedlam. I just said what I got out of what he was saying to me. Bedlam knows his stuff, but I dont really understand how it works, so I stated what I got out of it.


(Im telling you this so that Bedlam and Friends dont hound my errors)

allmotor_civic :

Wow I had no idea you could do that! do you feel an even power pull all the way up to redline? or does your cam cause a boost or jump when you use it at full go?

[nolimitsoldier]

My power is all low end...stupid small turbo, but 212lbs of torque at 3000 rpm is pretty cool :)

[Dallas J]

My car fall flat on its face(figuratively speaking of course :P) under 2k rpms, and doesnt seem to pull that hard at 1bar at the top end either. With the vericom I only traped 97mph...

But at sea level it was just sick how much more low end power i got. Full boost by 3200 rpms instead of at 4000 like i get here.

-Dallas J

[railsldr]

constant torque all the way through, gotta love the H23. Got torque curve? I do.

[TedR719]

Mad VTEC p03wEr 4 joo!

I mean top end power, we will see what I lay down here soon when I take her to get dyno'd! Hey Dan do you still have that manifold for sale?

[Bedlam]

Fortunately for me...the iVTEC motor is a little better with the low end than my Si was (thank the engineering gods for this ECU/motor combo) that car was a sluggish little bitch untill you got into vtec. The new car is definately a high-revver too...but once the 2nd stage vtec kicks in...and the CAI opens up to let the car breathe a bit...that motor just makes me as giddy as a little schoolgirl. Even in the RSX brochure they say that the car sounds like a formula racecar when its wrapped out...I didnt know about that with the stock airbox on there...but damn it sounds badass with the CAI! Thanks again to everyone who helped make it happen for me!

High revvers forever!!!

-Bedlam

[Bedlam]

Originally posted by WagN2NR
I didnt quote bedlam. I just said what I got out of what he was saying to me. Bedlam knows his stuff, but I dont really understand how it works, so I stated what I got out of it.

(Im telling you this so that Bedlam and Friends dont hound my errors)

Hell..I'd never hound someone for not knowing the ins and outs of a honda motor...honestly I dont know that much about how all the shit works in my car exactly, there is SO much going on in the new iVTEC mechanically and with the ECU that its a little hard for me to wrap my head around it. I may be a honda 'enthusiast' but hardly a resource.. :) Besides...all the other companys out there now bought the rights to use VTEC technology from honda in the last few years....I'm sure we'll see many more domestics and small imports with some flavor of vtec going on.

-Bedlam

[stu]

BMW already out did Honda with their infinitely variable system.

[Brian]

Originally posted by allmotor_civic
Dyno (at my disposal) + DOHC VTEC + Longer Stroke + Long Duration Cams + High Compression + Proper Fuel, Spark, and Cam timing = Flat torque curve (flat from 2900-5400, jumps at VTEC, relitively flat from 5600-8500). So fuc* all that deciding crap. I'll take both for 200 Alec.
Dan
P.S. "Torque is for burnouts, horsepower is for racing. Dave Coleman in SCC editorial"

HP is just a function of torque. Torque wins races, hp sells cars :D


What do you consider to be a lot of low end torque? When I had my SI with a supercharger running 10 psi I htought it had a lot of torque. It probably had 140 ft/lbs or so. My GTI with minimal mods is around the 240-260 range a tthe wheels at similar rpms :)

[Dallas J]

Ive read exactly how horse power figures were derived. And I have a pretty good idea of how hp and torque works with gearing. But the reason car companies give HP numbers is cause generally speaking HP doesnt change in different gears, but torque does.

-Dallas J

[Tsunami]

both my cars are V8's, one is a pushrod old school V8 with lots of low end grunt, the other is an all aluminum small block quad cam screamer, so I guess I have both :)

[allmotor_civic]

Ted,
I don't know...sorry bout the phone crap my cell was stolen at some f'ed up party. Brent went to Cali to pick up his new tube chassis car, so I haven't really been able to chat with him. I'll let you know Very soon though.
Brian,
Well were shooting for 150 ft/lbs+ from 5k to 8.5k here (non-SAE corrected numbers). So thats what I consider mad N/A torque for small displacement engines. Below and above those RPM's it only falls to about 141 ft/lbs (even at 1500). And yeah HP is a function of torque over a period of time...the actual correlation is (ft/lbs*RPM)/5252. Oh yeah and VeeDubs are dope for straight line stints...260wft/lbs is sick.
But, really...torque wins light to light and hp wins state to state.
Dallas,
Yeah, HP is rather constant, but remember that stock automobiles are rated at the flywheel...not wheels. So the real reason they rate that way is because typically HP numbers are higher than torque in modern cars (unless you redline at/or before 5252 RPM). Bigger numbers are more impressive so therefore you sell additional units.
Later,
Dan

[Brian]

That is very good torque for N/A. Very impressive.

[stu]

Torque is when you press down on your boner and your heels lift up.

[1998cc]

Originally posted by stu
Torque is when you press down on your boner and your heels lift up. :D lol

[TedR719]

Thanks Dan, I could come down there to pick it up this weekend but just let me know when you find out, PM me if you could.



Originally posted by allmotor_civic
Ted,
I don't know...sorry bout the phone crap my cell was stolen at some f'ed up party. Brent went to Cali to pick up his new tube chassis car, so I haven't really been able to chat with him. I'll let you know Very soon though.
Brian,
Well were shooting for 150 ft/lbs+ from 5k to 8.5k here (non-SAE corrected numbers). So thats what I consider mad N/A torque for small displacement engines. Below and above those RPM's it only falls to about 141 ft/lbs (even at 1500). And yeah HP is a function of torque over a period of time...the actual correlation is (ft/lbs*RPM)/5252. Oh yeah and VeeDubs are dope for straight line stints...260wft/lbs is sick.
But, really...torque wins light to light and hp wins state to state.
Dallas,
Yeah, HP is rather constant, but remember that stock automobiles are rated at the flywheel...not wheels. So the real reason they rate that way is because typically HP numbers are higher than torque in modern cars (unless you redline at/or before 5252 RPM). Bigger numbers are more impressive so therefore you sell additional units.
Later,
Dan

[12seccivy]

Originally posted by 1EightT
HP is just a function of torque. Torque wins races, hp sells cars :D


What do you consider to be a lot of low end torque? When I had my SI with a supercharger running 10 psi I htought it had a lot of torque. It probably had 140 ft/lbs or so. My GTI with minimal mods is around the 240-260 range a tthe wheels at similar rpms :)

it's funny that you say that.i agree about the torque being more dominant especially on the street, but i raced a 95 gti in my civic(before the supercharger) and we tied neck to neck.
we were trying to make a race from the light,but we ended up at a 15mph roll.when we dropped the signal he blasted a car length on me,but when i hit vtec,i blasted a 1/2 car on him.and we ended up pretty even by the time we hit 110.
honestly i think if we raced from the light i would have beat him.

[D2Coupe]

my RSX screams up to redline, the dips alittle before feul cutoff

the accord doesnt pull as nice, but some work will fix it

I-Vtec in both

[Brian]

Originally posted by 12seccivy
it's funny that you say that.i agree about the torque being more dominant especially on the street, but i raced a 95 gti in my civic(before the supercharger) and we tied neck to neck.
we were trying to make a race from the light,but we ended up at a 15mph roll.when we dropped the signal he blasted a car length on me,but when i hit vtec,i blasted a 1/2 car on him.and we ended up pretty even by the time we hit 110.
honestly i think if we raced from the light i would have beat him.

Yeah, but in 95 they also didn't have the 1.8t engine avaliable. It was either a 2.slow or a vr6. I'm guessing a VR6 if it was a good race though :)

[Brian]

Also don't get me wrong here. As far as N/A engine technology goes Honda owns the block. VTEC and I-VTEC are huge engineering feats that a lot of other companies are just now catching on to. They extend the power band much farther than expected for the size of the engines.

[12seccivy]

Originally posted by 1EightT
Yeah, but in 95 they also didn't have the 1.8t engine avaliable. It was either a 2.slow or a vr6. I'm guessing a VR6 if it was a good race though :)
it was a vr6 with some mild mods..
:eek:

[12seccivy]

Originally posted by 1EightT
Also don't get me wrong here. As far as N/A engine technology goes Honda owns the block. VTEC and I-VTEC are huge engineering feats that a lot of other companies are just now catching on to. They extend the power band much farther than expected for the size of the engines.

but really only in the 4 cylinder and some v6 applications.
as far as the normal(non vtec)v6 goes i would probably go with vw's or otherwise.
torque just has the right hair raising feel to it..:D
although i have been pretty impressed with the newer accord(03)v6.. they feel pretty peppy for what it has under the hood:eek:

[12seccivy]

Originally posted by D2Coupe
my RSX screams up to redline, the dips alittle before feul cutoff

the accord doesnt pull as nice, but some work will fix it

I-Vtec in both

yeah, i was pretty impressed with the RSX's torque especially in the upper RPM band...
i'd buy one. :cool: