Dyno Day

[rmcdaniels]

Got to the dyno today, local car club (Triangle Z Club) dyno day, so only $40, and they let me make a bunch of pulls.

This is on 20 PSI of boost:

http://s115271005.onlinehome.us/images/dyno38.JPG

[blackciv4]

Those are nice numbers! You went to a turbo setup right? Makes me want to trade in the Jackson.

[rmcdaniels]

Those are nice numbers! You went to a turbo setup right? Makes me want to trade in the Jackson.
It's a long story, but I wound up with an 8.4:1 compression motor and had to go turbo. Personally I prefer a supercharger, and someday I'll get back to SC.

[blackciv4]

Dont get me wrong I LOVE the powerband of the Jackson I just want more out of it. I have the JDM b16 so the compression is slightly higher. A week from Monday Tobi is installing a Hondata IM gasket and hopefully cam gears, we will see how that works out.

[marcrx5]

Nice numbers. They come a little late in the rpm, I can see why you liked your supercharger better.

[rmcdaniels]

Dont get me wrong I LOVE the powerband of the Jackson I just want more out of it. I have the JDM b16 so the compression is slightly higher. A week from Monday Tobi is installing a Hondata IM gasket and hopefully cam gears, we will see how that works out.
Also check out http://www.lhtperformance.net/intercooler_pics/interc.build.html . These guys build Laminova cores into the JR manifold. They also make a kick-ass header for JRSC cars.

And cam gears are huge with a JRSC, I picked up 20+ HP across the board with cam timing adjustments, Tobi will know exactly what to do for that, he told me about it a while back. Have you set VTEC to kick in lower? I had it coming on at any RPM over 2500 with positive manifold pressure.

And how much boost are you running? And what engine management?

[blackciv4]

Also check out http://www.lhtperformance.net/intercooler_pics/interc.build.html . These guys build Laminova cores into the JR manifold. They also make a kick-ass header for JRSC cars.

And cam gears are huge with a JRSC, I picked up 20+ HP across the board with cam timing adjustments, Tobi will know exactly what to do for that, he told me about it a while back. Have you set VTEC to kick in lower? I had it coming on at any RPM over 2500 with positive manifold pressure.

And how much boost are you running? And what engine management?

I have seen that web site before, matter of fact I think that you linked me to it. That would be great to have but they are a little much for only 5 psi. I usually have VTEC comming in at 4800 but I heard that it was bad to turn it too low without building the head, dont know it that is true. I might try lowering the vtec point. I have the fmu, fields vtec controller, and the JR MAP controller for management(BOO). I am only running the stock pulley for now but up here it will only hit about 4.5 - 5 psi. I dont want to push anymore boost until I have something better to manage the engine such as Hondata. For now though I want to see what I can do on 5psi. Any other mods that you did have a big improvement?

[rmcdaniels]

I have seen that web site before, matter of fact I think that you linked me to it. That would be great to have but they are a little much for only 5 psi. I usually have VTEC comming in at 4800 but I heard that it was bad to turn it too low without building the head, dont know it that is true. I might try lowering the vtec point. I have the fmu, fields vtec controller, and the JR MAP controller for management(BOO). I am only running the stock pulley for now but up here it will only hit about 4.5 - 5 psi. I dont want to push anymore boost until I have something better to manage the engine such as Hondata. For now though I want to see what I can do on 5psi. Any other mods that you did have a big improvement?
The MAP controller was actually the thing that helped me the most, mostly because it let me return the timing to almost stock. And you're correct to keep the boost low until you get something that lets you replace the stock injectors. I tried running it at 10-11 PSI with the FMU and stock injectors once and broke all my pistons from the detonation, also stretched my sleeves so far out of round they needed to be replaced, they were visibly oval. Other than that, lowering my VTEC engagement point to and getting rid of the stock valve overlap with some cam gears made the most difference. At one point I used the JR VPAC for VTEC and I also got the JR BTC for better timing control, picked up both used for cheap on ebay before I saved up for Hondata and some RC injectors. Hondata and some big injectors are the way to go for the JRSC setup though, add some cam gears and a good exhaust and it should be capable of well over 200 WHP if you up the boost. I made 201 WHP on 10-11 PSI with all my pistons and half my rings broken on a stock USDM B16.

[blackciv4]

The MAP controller was actually the thing that helped me the most, mostly because it let me return the timing to almost stock. And you're correct to keep the boost low until you get something that lets you replace the stock injectors. I tried running it at 10-11 PSI with the FMU and stock injectors once and broke all my pistons from the detonation, also stretched my sleeves so far out of round they needed to be replaced, they were visibly oval. Other than that, lowering my VTEC engagement point to and getting rid of the stock valve overlap with some cam gears made the most difference. At one point I used the JR VPAC for VTEC and I also got the JR BTC for better timing control, picked up both used for cheap on ebay before I saved up for Hondata and some RC injectors. Hondata and some big injectors are the way to go for the JRSC setup though, add some cam gears and a good exhaust and it should be capable of well over 200 WHP if you up the boost. I made 201 WHP on 10-11 PSI with all my pistons and half my rings broken on a stock USDM B16.

Hmmmm, good to know. I made 190whp up here at altitude but I think with "Tobi tunnin", IM gasket and cam gears it will be much more than that. I am just a little weary because of the higher compression. I know that it isn't that much but still... I would like to get the boost timming controller as well but dont really want to pay the price for a new one. The only thing I dont like about the Jackson is the lack of an intercooler besides the water injection, which I suppose is always a possibility. When you go back to a SC will you go with a eaton again or go with something different?

[rmcdaniels]

Hmmmm, good to know. I made 190whp up here at altitude but I think with "Tobi tunnin", IM gasket and cam gears it will be much more than that. I am just a little weary because of the higher compression. I know that it isn't that much but still... I would like to get the boost timming controller as well but dont really want to pay the price for a new one. The only thing I dont like about the Jackson is the lack of an intercooler besides the water injection, which I suppose is always a possibility. When you go back to a SC will you go with a eaton again or go with something different?
I have a JRSC kit and Whipple 1200AX with a Vortech shaft drive in my shop and I am test fitting different options on my extra B16 (dummy/shop engine). On the 20th I should have a new SC setup installed on the car that will make great low end power with plenty of boost right off idle and 400+ WHP at the top end, all while keeping intake temps under control (within 10-20 degrees of ambient air temp). I'll be testing it out at the drag strip, VIR (April 9-10), and autox over the course of the next month or two to see how it works and will post the results. I'm still convinced that for anything other than drag racing, a SC is my best option,but I want to keep the car making 350+ WHP, so I'm figuring out how to get around the limitations of the Eaton M62. Of course I've been working on this for years now, so who knows if I'll ever get it right, but it is fun to tinker. At times I'm tempted to just put some high compression pistons in the engine and run a JRSC with a ported S-tube for a 65mm TB, blower case porting modifications, LHT air/water intercooler, and blower/alternator/crank pulleys to make 13-15 PSI, but I think I can work out something better than that if I work at it.

[blackciv4]

I have a JRSC kit and Whipple 1200AX with a Vortech shaft drive in my shop and I am test fitting different options on my extra B16 (dummy/shop engine). On the 20th I should have a new SC setup installed on the car that will make great low end power with plenty of boost right off idle and 400+ WHP at the top end, all while keeping intake temps under control (within 10-20 degrees of ambient air temp). I'll be testing it out at the drag strip, VIR (April 9-10), and autox over the course of the next month or two to see how it works and will post the results. I'm still convinced that for anything other than drag racing, a SC is my best option,but I want to keep the car making 350+ WHP, so I'm figuring out how to get around the limitations of the Eaton M62. Of course I've been working on this for years now, so who knows if I'll ever get it right, but it is fun to tinker. At times I'm tempted to just put some high compression pistons in the engine and run a JRSC with a ported S-tube for a 65mm TB, blower case porting modifications, LHT air/water intercooler, and blower/alternator/crank pulleys to make 13-15 PSI, but I think I can work out something better than that if I work at it.
Sounds good. As with any gearhead I just want more! Do you think that it would be worth while to put more money into other parts or just do Hondata and more boost? How is that set up you are working on going? How do you keep the intake temps so low? I heard that a b18b crank pulley would make about 7 psi on a b-series with a Jackson have you heard this before? I love to tinker too but just dont have time anymore. I used to all the time but... Man I would love to see that when it is done, tons of low end but still have that high end as well, that is what most people are after. Tons of power with a nice usable powerband. I would love to take my car to the autox track but am too worried about the heatsoaking but, come Monday I should have that atleast a little better under controll. Thanks for all your input it is nice to see someone that likes the SC and is not telling me to ditch it, lol!

[rmcdaniels]

Sounds good. As with any gearhead I just want more! Do you think that it would be worth while to put more money into other parts or just do Hondata and more boost? How is that set up you are working on going? How do you keep the intake temps so low? I heard that a b18b crank pulley would make about 7 psi on a b-series with a Jackson have you heard this before? I love to tinker too but just dont have time anymore. I used to all the time but... Man I would love to see that when it is done, tons of low end but still have that high end as well, that is what most people are after. Tons of power with a nice usable powerband. I would love to take my car to the autox track but am too worried about the heatsoaking but, come Monday I should have that atleast a little better under controll. Thanks for all your input it is nice to see someone that likes the SC and is not telling me to ditch it, lol!I'd certainly look into the LHT manifold mod if you're keeping it, also a good header. Cody at Lovefab says he can make a good SC header and I tend to believe him as the other exhaust stuff that I've bought off of him is top quality and works very well. I'm not giving out details of the new setup until I get it patented, as I've had people interested in selling it if it works, but it should be completely installed on the 20th and my EMS tuner is coming over on the 29th to see if we can get it streetable.

I've heard a CRV pulley will bump up the boost, but JR makes pulleys for the crank and the blower that will raise the boost too. Endyn also makes a stepper pulley for the alternator that will raise the boost.

My JRSC was great for autox, but only after I got my LSD, before then it just completely unloaded the inside wheel, although it was still a lot of tire smoking, gravel spitting fun. The most important thing for autox for my Civic was getting the car more balanced when cornering, mostly by getting rid of excessive understeer with a bigger rear sway bar. I wouldn't worry about heat soak at 4-5 PSI, mine didn't really heat up until I raised the boost up to 10-11 PSI. I had some concerns about heat, so I made an intake air temp guage by drilling out a water injection jet and epoxying a bead/wire temp sensor into it. I screwed it into the water injection port on the JRSC manifold, which put it right in the output stream from the blower. I ran a wire back inside the car and taped the guage to my dash.

[blackciv4]

I'd certainly look into the LHT manifold mod if you're keeping it, also a good header. Cody at Lovefab says he can make a good SC header and I tend to believe him as the other exhaust stuff that I've bought off of him is top quality and works very well. I'm not giving out details of the new setup until I get it patented, as I've had people interested in selling it if it works, but it should be completely installed on the 20th and my EMS tuner is coming over on the 29th to see if we can get it streetable.

I've heard a CRV pulley will bump up the boost, but JR makes pulleys for the crank and the blower that will raise the boost too. Endyn also makes a stepper pulley for the alternator that will raise the boost.

My JRSC was great for autox, but only after I got my LSD, before then it just completely unloaded the inside wheel, although it was still a lot of tire smoking, gravel spitting fun. The most important thing for autox for my Civic was getting the car more balanced when cornering, mostly by getting rid of excessive understeer with a bigger rear sway bar. I wouldn't worry about heat soak at 4-5 PSI, mine didn't really heat up until I raised the boost up to 10-11 PSI. I had some concerns about heat, so I made an intake air temp guage by drilling out a water injection jet and epoxying a bead/wire temp sensor into it. I screwed it into the water injection port on the JRSC manifold, which put it right in the output stream from the blower. I ran a wire back inside the car and taped the guage to my dash.
I have a DC header that was made for the 98 and up Integra Type R so it has the 2.5 in collector and a high flow cat that follows that. Yeah I have also heard about the CRV pulley that is good for 10 psi but I was just thinking something a little more conservative. My swap came with LSD and I am so glad that is such a nice thing to have! I did the rear disk conversion off a 99 SI and also the sway but I think that a bigger one would still be better especially for the track(if I can ever find time to take it there). Do you think that water injection would be benifficial on only 5 psi or no? That is a good idea and also a valuable piece of information to have the incomming air temp! What kind of intake cooling method were you using if any when you had you Jackson? I think I saw something like you made your own cooler that sat between the blower and the manifold correct?

[rmcdaniels]

I have a DC header that was made for the 98 and up Integra Type R so it has the 2.5 in collector and a high flow cat that follows that. Yeah I have also heard about the CRV pulley that is good for 10 psi but I was just thinking something a little more conservative. My swap came with LSD and I am so glad that is such a nice thing to have! I did the rear disk conversion off a 99 SI and also the sway but I think that a bigger one would still be better especially for the track(if I can ever find time to take it there). Do you think that water injection would be benifficial on only 5 psi or no? That is a good idea and also a valuable piece of information to have the incomming air temp! What kind of intake cooling method were you using if any when you had you Jackson? I think I saw something like you made your own cooler that sat between the blower and the manifold correct?
I wouldn't use water injection for 5 PSI. I did use it at 10 PSI, but it was a PITA, the check valve malfunctioned and dripped water/methanol onto the rotor assembly and ate the coating off of it. I did make an intercooler, but my core and my reserve tank were too small, so it got heat soaked way too quickly under boost, although it was useful at the dyno because it did cool the intake assembly within a few seconds when making dyno runs. Normally I'd have to wait several minutes to cool the intake after a run. For all the work I did on it and the results I got, I'd let LHT do it for $1000 before I tried it again.

I'd say definitely get it to autox and see what the limits are. That will tell you what you want to do with the suspension. After a couple autox events, I had a much better idea of what I needed to change on my suspension.